avogadno's blog

U.S. President odds 2016

These are approximate Las Vegas odds.

Hilary -450
Trump +325

In other words, a $100 bet on Trump would win $325. For Hilary, a bet of $450 would be needed to win $100.

Hilary is a big favorite to win. We're gonna need to get used to saying "Madam President" for a change.

Btw, a "field" bet is +10000. I'm not sure who that represents but I'd take my chances with him or her.

A state religion.(Alcoholics Anonymous and Narcotics Anonymous)

Refer to my last blog post about Shoemaker calling for a Government -State Supervision of Religion.

I recall reading about the U.S. founding fathers that were pro religious control. They recognized however, that pushing religion would cause citizens to push back and decided to try and incorporate religious values in other ways.

Article from: American Atheist Magazine | March 22, 2003 | Russell, Kevin | Copyright

Shoemaker Calls for State Supervision of Religion

As similar as the OG is with AA and how close Sam Shoemaker was to AA's founding, it looks like his call for a "supervised" state religion came true. Remember, there are no coincidences.............

From an online pdf. 1936 Newsletter, The Presbytarian Guardian


Shoemaker Calls for State Supervision of Religion

Is AA a Cult? Excellent Article

Is Alcoholics Anonymous a Cult?
An Old Question Revisited

© L. Allen Ragels
All Rights Reserved

The “alcoholism cult.” That’s what Sheldon Bacon, for many years the director of the Rutgers Center for Alcohol Studies, called overly avid supporters of Alcoholics Anonymous.[1]

My Story: I Was Accused of Being an Addict

Here's an interesting and different point of view:


"Calling me an addict just because I treat my pain with opioids is simply cruel.

How desperately I wish I were “just an addict”.

"On the basis of reports by addicts, I can say that a ‘fix’ does indeed exceed in quality any known sexual pleasure."

"On the basis of reports by addicts, I can say that a ‘fix’ does indeed exceed in quality any known sexual pleasure."

“Studies of the reaction addicts have to a single dose of morphine reveal that many experience a feeling of exhilaration akin to an orgasm discharged in the abdominal region."

"It is entirely possible that the intensity of this pleasure exceeds any pleasure known to non-addicts."

Ironic quote of Carl Jung's

Carl Jung, Memories, Dreams, Reflections

“Schizophrenia was considered incurable. If one did achieve some improvement with a case of schizophrenia, the answer was that it had not been REAL schizophrenia" -my emphasis.

Perhaps Bill read this and decided it was a good argument against alcoholics getting sober outside of AA. That and "denial" being a symptom of alcoholism are such absurd arguments that I can't believe they are ever accepted. Are they? LOL

Narconan or 12 Step Rehab. What's worse?

http://www.cracked.com/personal-experiences-2114-inside-scientologys-sec... June 17, 2016

Whatever you think of the congealed puddle of lawsuits and evil known as Scientology, you've got to admire their ambition: They run churches, schools, and even a space Navy. They haven't even let their extremely limited understanding of drugs and medicine stop them from treating drug addicts!


FDA Approves First Implant to Treat Opioid Addiction

The US Food and Drug Administration has approved Probuphine, the first implantable drug for the treatment of opioid dependence. It’s a welcome development at a time when scores of Americans are addicted to painkillers such as OxyContin and Vicodin.

Great Australian article on AA (with Orange quotes)


It is super long so I copy and pasted only 1/4 of it.

"Australian Academic Misconceptions: Alcoholics Anonymous

The most widely available program for alcohol-dependent people in Australia

RIP Dick B., pro AA author.

Published 46 books and 1700 Articles on AA.

d. 9/29/2015

I didn't know till now.

What is "Real" Addiction?

12 Step Program Members (like Janus) claim that there is a difference between people that become addicted due to self medication (or other reasons) and so-called "real" addicts that become addicted because of "life". The latter are supposedly powerless, completely defenseless against using drugs/alcohol, unable to get or stay clean without the program. This is completely illogical.

The Buprenorphine Effect on Depression

The Buprenorphine Effect on Depression
By Richard Gracer, MD


Patients with opiate addiction, who are treated with buprenorphine, often ask why the buprenorphine eliminates their depression as well. Many of these people have never felt better in their lives since starting this drug.

Addiction Is a Choice

By Jeffrey A. Schaler, PhD
*I only partially copied from this article; a book review

Is addiction a disease, or is it a choice? To think clearly about this question, we need to make a sharp distinction between an activity and its results. Many activities that are not themselves diseases can cause diseases. And a foolish, self-destructive activity is not necessarily a disease.

What is "using"?

Janus claims that taking a prescription, MAT such as Suboxone, is USING. In response, I said that I didn't think it was. That has led me to try to establish what using is. Could it be that we disagree because we define "using" differently?

Applying the Clergy Privilege to Certain AA Communications



Interesting examination of AA member relationships as it pertains to the law, and an argument suggesting that it receive the the same privileges as religious clergy.

The author received first prize from the Cornell Law Library "Robert Cantwell" competition for exemplary student research.

Is an NA or AA sponsor legally a "counselor or therapist"?

Should sponsors be regarded as a counselor and held up to the same standards and responsibilities?

The state of Iowa defines a counselor or therapist as “a physician, psychologist, nurse, professional counselor, social worker, marriage or family therapist, alcohol or drug counselor, member of the clergy, or any other person, whether or not licensed or registered by the state, who provides or purports to provide mental health services”.

AA member and sponsor charged with attempted murder and sexual abuse


Found a link to this story on NADaytona.org which has done a great job in keeping up with current events in the alcoholics and narcotics anonymous community.

Mark Retterah from Osage, Iowa - the alleged victim's sponsor in Alcoholics Anonymous, has been charge with sexual abuse crimes and attempted murder.

Old but interesting news: National Drug Control Strategy

Sponsored by Senator Joe Biden in 1990 was the National Drug Control Strategy Act that supported the Federal criminal authorizing courts to allow early release of some drug dependent offenders with special conditions. Those specifically named as conditions were the following: “submission to periodic drug testing, regular attendance at meetings of Narcotics Anonymous, Alcoholics Anonymous, or Cocaine Anonymous, and participation in an outpatient substance abuse counseling program”.

Note: in 2007 Joseph Biden introduced the Recognizing Addiction as a Disease Act.

AA Buildings in Chicago Used in Abusive Rehab

Chicago media has recently released this local story:

Puerto Rico exports its drug addicts to Chicago
April 10, 2015, by Adriana Cardona-Maguigad

Island police and mayors direct heroin addicts to Chicago and other cities with promises of housing and treatment.

Finally found out what a "real alcoholic" is.

Janus has used the 'real alcoholic' or 'real addict' defense over a dozen times in her tenure on the opf. In another thread that she started about mystical experiences, she expands on what the addict is really searching for. In a nutshell, the real addict is one that desires an ego deflating spiritual experience, which of course she claims AA and NA provide.


Bill Wilson rips the wife

We are all familiar with the degrading and chauvinistic chapter "To Wives" from the Alcoholics Anonymous Big Book. Forum contributor 'The New Black' made a post recently that reminded me of that chapter when he mentioned how the 12 Steps aren't even about alcoholism.

Slimy - that is the word!


An oldie, but a goodie that hasn't been posted on the orange website yet. Written by a Catholic Priest and a good description of religious contradictions of AA. This was written early on in AA history. I commend people that penetrated AA's mask of "spiritual, not religious". This is a good reference for anyone that would like to describe some complications the 12 Step approach could have on many different religious people.

From the ECCLESIASTICAL REVIEW, Vol. 106: 285-288, April, 1942, by Paul L. O'Connor, S.J.

Works Publishing Stockholder Reports

More documents from Works Publishing, 6/30/1941, regarding profits, assets, shareholders, and future expectations for the Alcoholics Anonymous text.

Interesting findings:

Greetings on our Tenth Christmas ~from Bill

I typed out just a few lines from this little gem; a letter from Bill Wilson to "All All Members".

There isn't anything written about alcoholism recovery or sobriety, like in the steps (or spoken of at meetings) for that matter. The religious overtones are overwhelmingly present, as usual for AA and Billy.

12 Step member commits suicide


12 Step member commits suicide, but family thanks Judge that sent him there?

24 year old David Julian Chalmers took his own life (2007) less than two weeks before he graduated from Albany Drug Court. David was posthumously granted his diploma which was accepted by his parents.

The Alcoholics Anonymous Judge, Rogellio Flores, re: Karla Brada, Eric Allen Earle

Rogelio Flores is the judge that sentenced Erica Allen Earle, a violent convicted felon, to AA. Earle had been sentenced to AA by the judicial system a couple of dozen times and admitted to using it to pick of fragile women to take advantage of. After seducing Karla Brada and financial breaking her, Eric Earle beat her then later murdered her in a drunken rage.

Judge Flores was also an elected Class A trustee for the General Service Board of AA. Below is a historical account of Flores found on the AA website (it was also released to the press).

Youngsters and teenagers in AA, despite denial by brainwashed members

All too often AA trolls come along and claim that children or young people don’t go to meetings and carry on try to defend the dangers of the program as it might relate to adults. I personally have seen children, teenagers, and young people at meetings on a regular basis. Some were there because their parents didn’t have a sitter for them but the bulk that I have seen were members themselves. The followings is some back-up to show that young people are regulars in the program.

Orange..links on website

Hi Orange,

I'm unable to open http://www.orange-papers.org/orange-root570.html#Dinger

I found the link @ "Added more documentation about the Catholic Church banning Dr. Frank Buchman's Oxford Group and Moral Re-Armament, here."

I'm interested in reading that and also want to give you a heads up.



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