The Daily Bitch 4th March 2012

btnben's picture
Submitted by btnben on Sat, 03/03/2012 - 16:20

This is just a personal opinion, but I am getting severely pissed off with the trolls on here. They are going to kill off this forum if something isn't done about them. Trolls, like any other cancer, are best disposed of quickly.

This forum was great fun and was really starting to grow until the trolls arrived. Clara and Danny are currently ruining this forum. What does everyone else think?

Comments

alkieanon's picture

alkieanon

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 15:14

"How many alcoholics have you killed with this statement."
http://www.aagrapevine.org/forum/336?page=2#comment-1021

becket's picture

becket

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 15:24

You're back to killing with words? To whom do you direct your question? Which statement should anyone address? Why should anyone address any of these statements without first understanding what you mean by "kill[ing] with this statement"?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

alkieanon's picture

alkieanon

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 15:34

The subject says it all: "Rants on other forums".
Maybe it should have been "Rants posted on other forums".

btnben's picture

btnben

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 15:40

Anyone who believes that alcohol is cunning, baffling and powerful should have no problem accepting that words can kill...lol

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

becket's picture

becket

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 16:01

The one does not necessarily or even remotely lead to the other. Please explain this allegation, btnben.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

mfc66uk

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 15:26

At least we don't have to put up with the drunkalogs and listen to chapter five being read or recite that crappy little serenity prayer like a good little parrot but we still get the meaningless Billy babble posted On this site as if the trolls believe it as going to affect our views. I thought steppers were supposed to concentrate on keeping their side of the street clean and realise they are powerless over other things. Aren't they supposed to go and read that chapter on acceptance ,rather than get into conflicts.
Of course the the reality is so different, they are full of conceit and are brimming with self righteousness . They have to share at all costs. They are the type of AA member that most members dread joining their group. They have no humility and no real personality and are often controlled by another stepper. They sit at meetings praising the programme but never offer any real help to the newcomer and are condescending to the majority. They will still be sitting in a dirty old scout hut on a plastic chair in twenty years time saying they are sober one day at a time and thinking themselves the type of person that makes AA such a great place to be. The reality is the meeting would be much bigger if they weren't there. They can't do much else but sit on that plastic chair.

becket's picture

becket

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 15:39

Maybe you're not dealing with steppers.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

btnben's picture

btnben

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 15:46

Just had a look on fornits - someone doesn't like you...lol

http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=38410&start=495

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

live_free_or_die's picture

live_free_or_die

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 15:59

Wow is right. Those are some serious adjectives describing DannyBoy. Are they accutrate?

Hidemyass.com?

btw, what is a becket?

Alcoholics Anonymous: MyNotGodHasItCovered®
http://www.expaa.org/
http://bereanresearch.com/
http://badrecovery.blogspot.com/
NOT AA:
Rational Recovery, SOS, HAMS
http://alcoholabusesolutions.com/

btnben's picture

btnben

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 16:02

A Vision for You

...Two days later, a future fellow of Anonymous Alcoholism stared glassily at the strangers beside his bed. "Who are you fellows, and why this private room? I was always in a ward before."

Said one of the visitors, "We're giving you a treatment for alcoholism."

Hopelessness was written large on the man's face as he replied, "Oh, but that's no use. Nothing would fix me. I'm a goner. The last three times, I got drunk on the way home from here. I'm afraid to go out the door. I can't understand it."

Asked one of the visitors, "Can you move your right hand?"

With a puzzled look on his face, the man tried it and discovered that he could.

Asked one of the visitors, as he offered a glass to the man, "Can you pick this up with your right hand, and put it to your mouth?"

The man tried it. "Why, yes, I can," said the man.

One of the visitors filled the glass with whiskey, and handed it to the man, and asked, "Can you use your right hand to lift this glass to your mouth, and drink all of this?"

The man discovered that he could.

One of the visitors filled the glass with whiskey again, and handed it to the man, and asked, "Can you use your left hand to lift this glass to your mouth, and drink all of this?"

The man discovered that he could do that, too.

Said one of the visitors, "That explains it. That is what is happening to you on the way home from here. At least one of your hands is lifting glasses of whiskey to your mouth, and you are drinking the whiskey. That is why you are getting drunk."

Said the man, "This is amazing. No one has ever been able to explain it to me so clearly before. I want to join your church right now."

The visitors thought they noticed something different about him already. He had begun to have a spiritual experience.

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Clara's picture

Clara

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 16:10

Funny, but completely inaccurate. Amazing that you could devote the time to this yet be concerned about the posting of another.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

becket's picture

becket

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 16:03

And your point, btnben?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

btnben's picture

btnben

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 16:05

.... ya don't get drunk. Nice simple one step program...lol

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Clara's picture

Clara

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 16:11

And that is what we say. It's great if you can stay stopped, but many cannot.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

btnben's picture

btnben

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 16:18

"Last Word" is back clogging up the place. 'Night folks.

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

humanspirit

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 16:52

Bummer about the Spurs/Man U result, but you might not agree!

Work in the morning :( . Still, another day, another dollar!

causeandeffect's picture

causeandeffect

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 17:21

Clara keeps saying that AA says it's not the only way to stay sober. I'd never heard of any other ways when I was in AA. Has anybody else heard of AA saying there are other ways? And if so, what were they?

Troll free AA critical forum
http://www.expaa.org/

"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it." ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 17:21

Jails, Institutions, Death. The usual cult answer.......

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

Pennywise's picture

Pennywise

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 17:21

I have, C&E. Many steppers will reluctantly admit this because even the most assimilated of drones know that it is bad public relations to say AA is the only way for everyone. But they'll always qualify it by saying it is the only for them and maybe you too.

"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid."

causeandeffect's picture

causeandeffect

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 17:26

Do you mean they will reluctantly admit it under pressure, or will they reluctantly admit it in meetings. I'm with JR in only hearing the "jails, institutions and death" mantra, and I'm pretty sure he lives in the opposite side of the country from me.

Troll free AA critical forum
http://www.expaa.org/

"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it." ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson

Pennywise's picture

Pennywise

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 17:39

I have heard some say it in meetings. Even some gurus. It is usually along the lines of "AA might not be the only way, but it was the last house on the street for me. Without AA I'd be dead, but thanks to God and the Fellowship of Alcoholics Anonymous, I don't have to take a drink today." This is usually said at meetings where new prospects are present, and probably has a lot to do with trying not to scare off fresh meat. But maybe some of them really mean it. They're not all equally dogmatic.

"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid."

Trisha K.'s picture

Trisha K.

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 17:50

I wondered how long you could hold out before you went into your delusional fantasies of AA.
Now I know,1hour and 27mins. I know, JR has that effect on a lot of people around here. You are not responsible for any other action you take aside from drinking. I understand, I really do.
At least we had a hour and half of rational conversation with you. Take care.
Good night...:)

“The more I traveled the more I realized that fear makes strangers of people who should be friends.”
Shirley MacLaine

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 17:51

I do think that the cults identified by the UK aacultwatch site are pretty accurate. I don't really object to people trying to help other people, but the fanatics that have setup a revolving door for prospects really bothers me. From my research they are all the creme of the crop sociopaths with a financial reason. Oftentimes they are just pawns in the bigger picture, but they are helping the movers and shakers make the big bucks and just don't realize it.

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 17:55

That's how it is said around here too. Some are more bold though and say it "is the ONLY way to get sober". That's breaking the rules arent they supposed to use I statements and talk only about their experience?. The lecturing old timers are so annoying. Always the same nonsense, repeating E,S, and Hope bullshit when they show no strength and their message of hope helped me in no way.
Spiritual not Religious. Only way. I'm a miracle. If you stop going to meetings... They really need someone in charge so that people can't spew out opinions and lies without being corrected.

I'd like a time warp please, back to the rooms so when it was my turn to speak I could say it like it was. I never had enough "time" to talk though. I had to shut up and listen, but don't think. How do you listen but not think?

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

Clara's picture

Clara

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 18:23

You know, when I started reading the SMART Recovery manuel, I was taken aback by the similarities and the fact that I had done much of that in AA and so did others I knew. It really just seems like steps and traditions reworded to me. But I think even with SMART you have to have faith in the program for it even to work. Some of it sounds nutty, naming your addiction and saying "powerful" things to it, such as "Scat, you bad boy, you!"

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

Clara's picture

Clara

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 18:26

You know, when I started reading the SMART Recovery manuel, I was taken aback by the similarities and the fact that I had done much of that in AA and so did others I knew. It really just seems like steps and traditions reworded to me. But I think even with SMART you have to have faith in the program for it even to work. Some of it sounds nutty, naming your addiction and saying "powerful" things to it, such as "Scat, you bad boy, you!" To me, both programs agree that alcoholism is a disease of the mind.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

btnben's picture

btnben

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 19:20

This is the first time i've EVER seen anyone say SMART is ANYTHING LIKE AA. They are so different it is untrue. Sounds like someone is willing to see things that aren't there to make their case...lol.

You say you read about addiction? What do you think of the Base Brain idea? Recognising when it is talking and speaking to it?

You say this is nutty but C2H5OH (no where near complex enough to form part of even the simplest protien, let alone have a central nervous system) is cunning, baffling and powerful? You can actually say that without feeling a complete idiot?...lol

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

AntiDenial

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 19:24

SMART does not believe in the disease model period.

Articles of Criminals In Alcoholics Anonymous and Narcotics Anonymous
www.nadaytona.org

btnben's picture

btnben

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 19:27

1. No guru
2. No praying
3. No steps
4. You graduate from SMART
5. No sponsors
6. No traditions
7. No religion
8. NO LIES

These were just off the top of my head. I'm sure there are many more. Feel free to add to the list...lol

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Clara's picture

Clara

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 19:39

You are right. It doesn't call it a disease. It calls it the Enemy lurking in your mind that you can name anything you want and tell it just to "Scat, you jerk. I am stronger than you..." That is a disease of the mind, my dear. Phrased differently. So how can the Enemy "tell" you something, that your addiction can speak to you yet when someone says, "that's your disease sayin' that," you are all over it? SMART even agrees that you have a part, as does AA.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

btnben's picture

btnben

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 19:47

When AA says "That is your disease talking" it is used by sponsors/oldtimers to shut people up when they ask embarrassing questions. Everyone one on here will have experienced that. You say "I don't feel like going to a meeting tonight" - sponsor say "That is your disease talking".

That is completely different to what SMART means when they talk about the "Enemy" telling you things. The "Enemy" is your Base Brain, where all addiction stems from - medical stuff, not mumbo jumbo...lol. Learning to recognise when it is your Base Brain speaking is paramount to actively fighting an addiction yourself (rather than being a lazy bastard and leaving it all to a higher power). They may say similar things, but, because of AA's way of changing the meaning of words, they actually mean completely different things.

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Clara's picture

Clara

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 19:49

Didn't AA say it first? How did it change anything? You are being silly, Ben.

Off to bed, kids. Spike has an MRI tomorrow, so it will be a busy day. Have fun and try to play nicely!

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

btnben's picture

btnben

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 19:55

You're losing it "Last Word"...lol.

Did you actually understand what I wrote? I asked you before about your opinion on the Base Brain idea. Is that it? you think it's "silly"...lol. I just love expert opinion...lol

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

causeandeffect's picture

causeandeffect

Sun, 03/04/2012 - 20:02

No AA didn't say any of this first. You'd have to be nuts to think they are anything similar.

Troll free AA critical forum
http://www.expaa.org/

"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it." ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson

Clara's picture

Clara

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 05:09

You can disagree all that you want, Cause. The program of AA just wasn't a fit for you, and that is fine. It doesn't claim to be, and neither does SMART or any program. That isn't realistic to think that any one thing will work for everybody in every circumstance. But AA as well as Smart recognizes that their are other options, and AA invites you to do what you have to do for you. You even went to the ridiculous low of asking what page the options were printed on. Well, given that the BB was written in 1939, there isn't going to be a page with Hazelden, Betty Ford, Alcoholics Victorious, SMART or any of those. They didn't exist. I notice that those same things aren't listed anywhere in SMART's literature, either, yet they did ixist in 1992 when that program was founded.

I personally see a number of similarities these two programs and I think both have merit and the ability to help alot of people, but the difference for you and me is that AA worked for me.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

Brett

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 05:15

Ya problem is you actually think that A.A works, the truth is it's never worked for anyone, your just another poor deluded soul, you have my pity.
P.S. get a job- a real one

Brett

Clara's picture

Clara

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 05:30

I retired from a real job. Why is it that people say such things when they would be thrilled with your energy - if it supported their cause? I have seen many AA success stories. But you are right. There are some people that it didn't work for, and I hope they found something that did. I'll save working for you guys.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

Brett

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 05:40

The miracle of smoke & mirrors as worked by the A.A fellowship. 12 step programs have never worked, pretty much like it's disfunctional members.
Get a real job, stop ya bludgen ways

Brett

Clara's picture

Clara

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 06:13

I am sorry, Brett, but I don't understand your dialect. I had a real job, but I retired in my early forties, so that isn't an issue for me anymore.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

btnben's picture

btnben

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 06:15

You are not sorry - you are just playing AA one-upmanship. Not exactly rigorously honest.

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Clara's picture

Clara

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 06:19

I guess you are right. I am not sorry that I can't understand Brett's colloquial English. But he got the gist, I am sure. Smart lad, he is.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 05:42

What does Clancy think about your male Sponsor? Did he bless the union?

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

btnben's picture

btnben

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 05:53

........... seeing how you've brought the subject up...lol. Clancy has a bit of a rep with the ladies, but not with the ladies themselves I understand. Ever get luck "Last Word"? Get a bit of Clancy style sobriety? Only joking. After 4 foul mouthed UK men probably didn't have the time (does beg the question though. If the first was so bad, why go on for another 3...lol)

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 05:59

Sex sells and Clancy knows it. Example: Midtown and Mike Q..............

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

Clara's picture

Clara

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 06:16

Because it is just their culture. They literally had no idea how badly they sounded. It isn't as if they called me anything. They just spoke poorly. I understood they were from "good" families, the McAteers. Athletes from ages ago... But Prince Charles has a mouth on him, too, so what can you say?

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

btnben's picture

btnben

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 06:18

But do stop hijacking threads with irrelevance.

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Clara's picture

Clara

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 06:23

You don't have to respond, Ben.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

btnben's picture

btnben

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 05:57

" But you are right. There are some people that it didn't work for, " - implies an unfortunate few. In fact, it didn't work for 95% or more - the fortunate majority. Stop twisting the truth "Last Word". You are not going to get away with it any more.

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Clara's picture

Clara

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 06:17

I am not concerned about that. It worked 100% for me and my hsuband, and that is what matters. I can't find any stats on SMART other than its says that they have a great success with getting people into recovery. How many ways can that be read? I know people that have no problem getting INTO recovery. It is staying with it...

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

btnben's picture

btnben

Mon, 03/05/2012 - 06:20

AA frowns on it you know. Lying will lead you back to drinking. Haven't you read the BB?

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

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