WOW!

Came here a few times because I thought it would be a good place to "air my grievances". Finding out that people are splitting up over, well I don't know what. Look, if you don't agree with something, and you wouldn't say what you're thinking about someone, to said someone offline....then take a walk, a break, or even a fucking drink! Anything that will postpone the blitz of crazy that this site has seen! However, this may be the end result of something that was born out of trying to hurt something instead of healing something.... Steppers be like.....GOT'EM! Damn...

Comments

DeConstructor's picture

One of the things many people need that leave AA- or any other religion-is a better reaction than the obligatory bobble head agreement thinking. It is okay to have different opinions than other people, and certainly okay to defend your position. When we see people resort to nasty personal comments-escalated to outrageous lies rather than answering questions, it simply is a sign that they do not have much of a logical argument. Whenever anyone begins to make these faulty personal attacks towards me, I know the end of the battle is near and they have lost. I think it is amplified here, because we have a lot of people that were hurt badly, and may not yet have robust coping skills to deal with their new found knowledge. This is combined with an anger from mistreatment from a cult and industry that has claimed the lives of friends of all of us. It is always better to make a better argument than to throw a temper tantrum.
criticoolthinking's picture

most people use a public persona and act polite and correct, but if they never express upset messy feelings they are fake liars. they are sometimes referred to as toxic heros. they project their own human flaws outward with shamelessness onto other people dealing with problems openly, they look down their nose and smile in contempt and berate and devalue others who's public and private persona match. they are afraid of trully authentic persons' doing the hard messing feelings work in society. they hide behind their stage show act like bing crosby's from an inauthentic look good hell. while other people do the real work and effect solutions by getting their hands dirty. and talking about the problems. aka assigning upset feeling value - which acknowledges and differentiates and prioritizes real problems.

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i embrace a multi-pathic view of disease and behavior science. neither is the only way for everyone, people are unique, some get diseases, some don't. some needs are beyond will power. some are not. group think kills individuals! critty cat.

this place is full of wankers but you will get the good stuff if you hang around..
fuck it.."were all stardust" tyson,dawkins,hawkings,sagan..various other people ive read
NoAAUK's picture

'I think it is amplified here, because we have a lot of people that were hurt badly, and may not yet have robust coping skills to deal with their new found knowledge. This is combined with an anger from mistreatment from a cult and industry that has claimed the lives of friends of all of us.' I totally agree with what you have said here 'It is always better to make a better argument than to throw a temper tantrum.' We don't agree on many things, some of us are Atheists or Agnostics, others are Believers whether Christian or not. There is probably a very wide spectrum of different beliefs amongst the many who visit this website, we are not meant to agree on everything (unless we become indoctrinated head bobbing cult zombies), everybody has different life experiences that make us different. But all Anti steppers agree that for the sake of future generations mental health, the false ideas of the cult of steppism must be challenged and eventually stopped. I don't think throwing a temper tantrum will help us with this. I fully realise I don't get things right all the time, I wouldn't have ended up addicted to nicotine, alcohol and cocaine if I did. In fact getting involved with the cult of steppism was probably the worst thing I ever did
......and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Matthew 24:11
NoAAUK's picture

'but you will get the good stuff if you hang around.' I did
......and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Matthew 24:11
NoAAUK's picture

Good to hear from you again. 'However, this may be the end result of something that was born out of trying to hurt something instead of healing something....' I see your point and can even appreciate why some people use censorship of any criticism of this cult that so dominates the substance misuse treatment sector, because they are frightened to upset these people. However I don't believe you can solve a problem by ignoring it, any person who has used alcohol to blot out a problem should realise this. At the end of the day somebody has the dirty job of hurting the false cult of steppism, which has seriously hurt and even killed so many over the years it has been allowed to flourish through deceptive recruiting and censorship of the truth. It would be nice to heal steppism, AA could actually achieve so much if it just discarded its lying, fear mongering 1930's cult doctrine (of which those 12 steps are the core) and actually became what it pretends to be (to recruit more victims), a support group, not a cult. In theory we could even have Moderation and Harm reduction nights as well as total abstinence nights. But steppism will never change and therefore the truth of this cult must be exposed by somebody, despite so unpalatable side effects
......and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Matthew 24:11
AntiDenial's picture

I would keep in mind that even though the Orange Papers is a great and pretty well known resouce critical of 12 step programs, it is not the only place or person. People are writing books, articles, making movies, on the radio and their our other blogs. The anti-AA movement is pretty damn strong and growing stronger outside the rather small world of the opf. There is no stopping exposing AA and other 12 step programs. As far as healing AA instead of hurting I think what is going on is both. Some of us are trying to expose AA to hold AA and NA accountable for the dangerous situations they put people in when they attend meetings. One day we might see put in safety measures and maybe we we will see the stopping of court mandates. But AA is not going to change their toxic message and dogma. There is no healing their message that is set in stone. Telling people they have a lifelong progressive disease that is incurable and that you are powerless should be a message that is hurt and erased from the minds of Americans and others worldwide. It has slowed down progress on addiction.

"I welcome all allies in the fight against A.A. hegemony" -Orange

www.leavingaa.com www.expaa.org

NA DAYTONA Violent Criminals Mandated to AA and NA Meetings
http://nadaytona.org/alcoholics-anonymous-votes-no-to-protect-members-from...

dorak nob's picture

at least here some true anger comes boiling out, I remember many times being asked how I was feeling at AA meeting my reply was a constant feeling good. On the inside would be feeling the pent up rage and anger that only someone who is programmed to say one thing while feeling another is taught. And being told the big lie that when finished with the steps the miracle would happen. That all the confusion would leave and I would be at peace with myself and the world, sometimes it's good for me to think about why I left AA . As i remember in AA we weren't allowed to feel anger.
dorak nob