Are Alcoholics Anonymous (AA) District Committee Members (DCMs) supposed to be paid a conference "Stipend" for their work against AA Tradition 8?

JR Harris's picture
Submitted by JR Harris on Thu, 02/14/2013 - 21:11

Are AA District Committee Members (DCMs) supposed to be paid a conference "Stipend" for their work? Well if you are in Alcoholics Anonymous Multi-District Area 54 in Sumter County (the same as Akron, Ohio and Dr. Bobs Shrine (http://www.drbobshome.com/) they just raised the "stipend" from $75 to $100.

AKRON MULTIDISTRICT 1, 2, 3, 4, 49, 50, 60,62
MINUTES FOR JANUARY 19, 1013
Meeting opened with I Am Responsible Pledge & Serenity Prayer @ 1602

{snip}

DCM Report:
• Roosevelt T-D2- At the Front Porch moved from D4 to D2—to recruit GSR
• Bill H- D1-Update Group Services Info ; Bridging Gap Program-Treatment Facilities given
recovery coaches provided according to zip codes
• Ron O – D62- Sobriety Station in Barberton @ 6:30 needs help
• Dave R- D3- moved out of his district—unable to f/u at most of meetings as of late
• Carol T- D4- gave resignation letter

(snip}

New Business
• Dark Districts * Vincent W nominated as replacement DCM for Carol T in District 4-- voted
and approved * other talk of Dark District tabled to next meeting
• Brought to table to increase conference stipend for DCM's from $75 to $100—voted and approved


Source: http://area54.org/pdfs/amd/amdjan2013.pdf

Tradition 8 (Long Form)
Alcoholics Anonymous should remain forever nonprofessional. We define professionalism as the occupation of counseling alcoholics for fees or hire. But we may employ alcoholics where they are going to perform those services for which we might otherwise have to engage nonalcoholics. Such special services may be well recompensed. But our usual A.A. “12 Step” work is never to be paid for.

Source: http://www.aa.org/bigbookonline/en_appendicei.cfm

Is going to a "conference" for alcoholics with alcoholics a form of 12 Step Work? Why is it being paid for?

Comments

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Fri, 02/15/2013 - 14:55

Do the Alcoholics Anonymous North East General Service Area 54 DCMs get a "stipend" for planning a conference? Why don't the GSRs get a "stipend" for the work they do when going to an Alcoholics Anonymous District Meeting to report what is going on in the AA groups? What about the 78th Founders Day Anniversary of Alcoholics Anonymous for 2013?

Conference Schedule

Mini-Conference Planning Meeting, 2:00 PM
Radisson Hotel Cleveland Airport West
25070 Country Club Blvd
North Olmsted, OH 44070
February 24, 2013

38th NE Ohio Mini-Conference Gv Lit
Radisson Hotel Cleveland Airport West
25070 Country Club Blvd
North Olmsted, OH 44070
Apr 5 - 7, 2013

Founders' Day - 78th Anniversary of AA
Hosted by Akron Intergroup
June 7 - 9, 2013

Source: http://www.aaneoh.org/schedule.html

Founders' Day 78th Anniversary of Alcoholics Anonymous

June 7, 8 & 9, 2013 | Akron, Ohio

2013 PRICING INFORMATION

Basic Registration - $20.00 provides entrance to the conference and all meetings.

Package Plan A - $180.00 includes:

- Basic Registration (ribbon & name badge)
- Accomodations (Friday & Saturday night)
- Saturday breakfast, lunch, and dinner
- Sunday breakfast
- Bus tour of the historic sites

Package Plan B - $130.00 includes:

- Basic Registration (ribbon & name badge)
- Accomodations (Friday & Saturday night)
- Bus tour of the historic sites

Source: http://foundersdayregistration.akronaa.org/

Is the "stipend" for DCMs in Area 54 per day or event?

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

dave

Fri, 02/15/2013 - 21:06

GSR's would go to the aa group they represent to get money to attend a conference. A DCM would go to his district for money to attend a conference. The DCM no longer has an aa meeting to represent.

If a group supports their GSR they would want to pay for them to go.

When I was DCM the district money paid for me and my alternate dcm's air fair multiple times. When I first had my airfare and hotel paid for by the district I was surprised. I announced it at several meeting that district money was paying my expences to attend a conference. To my surprise, the consensus from members that approached me was that my expences should be covered. This is also covered in the service manual.

dave

Fri, 02/15/2013 - 21:25

and lodging paid to attend area assemblies. The Areas Assembly could be held on any island. District meetings are usually close to the GSR's aa meeting, but in alaska or montana there could be a long distance to travel so I would bet that those GSR's often get reimbursed for travel expenses from the meeting they represent.

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Fri, 02/15/2013 - 22:25

I had a feeling you'd be able to answer my questions Dave. The conferences that the General Service Representative (GSR) and District Committee Member (DCM) go to are also open to any AA member if I am not mistaken. The GSR normally attends "business meetings" of each "GROUP" and the DCM holds "business meetings" over the "GROUPS" in a geographical area.

Are these "meetings" considered "12 Step work" and do you have to be an "Alcoholic" to be a GSR or DCM?

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

dave

Fri, 02/15/2013 - 22:54

aa meeting has a business meeting the GSR should attend. Not all aa meetings have regular business meetings, but if the meeting has a GSR they probably have business meetings. Not all meetings have GSR's and it is not a requirement. GSR's and DCM's are aa members. GSR's elect a DCM who chairs the district meeting and sets the agenda for 2 years. You could call a district meeting a business meeting, but I would say the meeting covers more than business. All conferences that I know of are open to all aa members except the general service conference held in new york. Any aa member could attend a district meeting also.

Is a district meeting 12 step work.
I think general service (gsr's, dcm's etc) facilitate unity in aa. General service also tries to keep aa in tact for future generations. I would say district and area events foster unity which helps keep aa whole which makes future 12 step work possible. The individual aa meetings have custody of the recovery portion of AA where individual 12 step work takes place. Does that answer you question. You pretty much have it correct.

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Sat, 02/16/2013 - 05:45

So actually AA meetings are not considered "12 Step work" with perhaps the exception of "newcomers meetings" where prospective "sponsors" circle around newcomers like vultures? The only other "group" 12 Step work would possibly be the 24 hour hotline manned normally at or by the telephone system of an Intergroup?

What I'm trying to do is identify what "12 Step work" is because it is what is supposed to "save" the hopeless alcoholic. If regular meetings at the group or district level are not considered "12 Step work" what are they?

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

dave

Sat, 02/16/2013 - 21:45

message to the alcoholic who still suffers. This is the main thing in my opinion. I think most aa members would agree.

AA meetings and all other aa service type meetings including the intergroup are making 12th step work possible and fulfilling their primary purpose.

Some aa members would agree with you that "newcommer meetings" and a 24hr phone number carry the message better and are pure 12th step work.

I think 12th step work is more one on one communication. Carring the message to the alcoholic who still suffers does not necessarily have to be one on one. A meeting schedule is part of carring the message.

I dont swarm like a vulture when I meet a new guy in aa.

live_free_or_die's picture

live_free_or_die

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 05:40

The AA program is about finding god and having god keep one sober. That is magical thinking dave, magical thinking that is carried to the individual that is "suffering". When god does not perform the promised magic dave the "suffering" becomes worse.

AA will fuck you up.

© 2013

Alcoholics Anonymous: MyNotGodHasItCovered®
http://www.expaa.org/
http://bereanresearch.com/
http://badrecovery.blogspot.com/
NOT AA:
Rational Recovery, SOS, HAMS
http://alcoholabusesolutions.com/

dave

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 09:55

what happens. I am just trying to explain the structure.

live_free_or_die's picture

live_free_or_die

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 16:25

AA/12 steps kills people. AAproved criminals are in the rooms of AA. AA/12 steps don't work.

Alcoholics Anonymous: MyNotGodHasItCovered®
http://www.expaa.org/
http://bereanresearch.com/
http://badrecovery.blogspot.com/
NOT AA:
Rational Recovery, SOS, HAMS
http://alcoholabusesolutions.com/

dave

Fri, 02/15/2013 - 22:55

aa meeting has a business meeting the GSR should attend. Not all aa meetings have regular business meetings, but if the meeting has a GSR they probably have business meetings. Not all meetings have GSR's and it is not a requirement. GSR's and DCM's are aa members. GSR's elect a DCM who chairs the district meeting and sets the agenda for 2 years. You could call a district meeting a business meeting, but I would say the meeting covers more than business. All conferences that I know of are open to all aa members except the general service conference held in new york. Any aa member could attend a district meeting also.

Is a district meeting 12 step work.
I think general service (gsr's, dcm's etc) facilitate unity in aa. General service also tries to keep aa in tact for future generations. I would say district and area events foster unity which helps keep aa whole which makes future 12 step work possible. The individual aa meetings have custody of the recovery portion of AA where individual 12 step work takes place. Does that answer you question. You pretty much have it correct.

NoAAUK's picture

NoAAUK

Sat, 02/16/2013 - 03:00

'GSR's would go to the aa group they represent to get money to attend a conference. A DCM would go to his district for money to attend a conference.'

GSR's DCM's....money? Its a wonder this nonsense can be taken seriously as a cure for anything this day and age let alone be organised and have any money.

What a sad word we live in

......and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Matthew 24:11

dave

Sat, 02/16/2013 - 21:41

Today I believe more people need to attend these conferences.

live_free_or_die's picture

live_free_or_die

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 05:46

dave.

© 2013

Alcoholics Anonymous: MyNotGodHasItCovered®
http://www.expaa.org/
http://bereanresearch.com/
http://badrecovery.blogspot.com/
NOT AA:
Rational Recovery, SOS, HAMS
http://alcoholabusesolutions.com/

dave

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 10:04

get the word out.

live_free_or_die's picture

live_free_or_die

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 16:27

dave, do you have any suggestions on getting the word out that AA/12 steps don't work and that AA/12 steps causes more harm than good?

Alcoholics Anonymous: MyNotGodHasItCovered®
http://www.expaa.org/
http://bereanresearch.com/
http://badrecovery.blogspot.com/
NOT AA:
Rational Recovery, SOS, HAMS
http://alcoholabusesolutions.com/

dave

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 17:48

I dont know how the legal battle is going everywhere. I know other alternatives are offered in some jurisdictions. If its possible I think their needs to be some statistics that everyone agrees on as to the efficacy of aa. I truly doubt that all non alcoholic aa trustees know what the long term sobriety rates are for people sent to aa. I think the people sending people to aa need to be informed. I would think this would be a daunting task and would take a lot of work.

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 18:09

I would say that the problem in AA is like that of the Catholic Church and the Boy Scouts. All three organizations are still around and all three organizations have covered up these problems. The Catholic Church and the Boy Scouts are larger than AA and they have been made to change. If it can be done with them, then it can be done with AA.

Are you aware that the Peoples Temple of Jim Jones in California was credited as being an excellent drug and rehabilitation organization and many people were sent there by the government? It was not until the fatal day of November 18, 1978 when Leo Ryan, a Congressman from the San Francisco area investigating claims of abuse was killed at an airport at Peoples Temple at Jonestown, Guyana along with three journalists, and one of the Temple defectors? That was when the mass suicide/killing of 918 people died, including 276 children who were being "saved" from the evils of drug addiction by being put in a cult using faith healing...

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

Pennywise's picture

Pennywise

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 18:19

Such statistics are meaningless when it comes to alcohol drinking and here is why:

1) It makes sense to only count the people who actually want to quit. Most people in AA probably want to get off probation and begin drinking again. But they won't tell you that, and there is no real way to verify people's true intentions until they act.

2) When a person takes a drink again, at least after the acute withdrawal stage, it is reasonable enough proof that the person didn't really want to be sober. This is because drinking is a choice and Bill Wilson was wrong about "strange mental blank spots." It would make no sense to judge a weight-loss program by the number of people who fail to follow the program, and it likewise makes no sense to judge a sobriety program by people who choose to drink anyway.

3) Any program of abstinence works if you work it. As long as an element of the program involves not drinking, everyone who follows the program will be sober. So the success rate will be 100%. It all comes down to the fact that drinking is a voluntary behavior that entails a choice.

"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid."

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 18:23

The same can be said about any "recidivism" problems involving choice. The idea is to determine the best way to stop the offending behavior. If you gave life imprisonment or the death penalty for any behavior deemed socially unacceptable, you would have no recidivism and the program would have a 100% success rate.

In AA, you either have a spiritual life imprisonment or you end up dead. This is the same idea using the same logic. The idea is to find the best way to handle it. Just because it "works if you work it" is true, doesn't mean it is the best or even preferred way. Just the way that it is being handled right now.

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

Pennywise's picture

Pennywise

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 18:48

"The same can be said about any "recidivism" problems involving choice. The idea is to determine the best way to stop the offending behavior. If you gave life imprisonment or the death penalty for any behavior deemed socially unacceptable, you would have no recidivism and the program would have a 100% success rate."

Precisely. All you can do is make the external consequences more severe up to the point of incapacitating the person or causing the person to voluntarily change his behavior. At some point in that continuum some people might just get tired of the internal consequences and quit on their own, or they might die.

"In AA, you either have a spiritual life imprisonment or you end up dead. This is the same idea using the same logic. The idea is to find the best way to handle it. Just because it "works if you work it" is true, doesn't mean it is the best or even preferred way. Just the way that it is being handled right now."

AA does not have the power to imprison your spirit because there is no such thing as a spirit to imprison. The best way to deal with it is make a policy call and either imprison their bodies or allow them to self destruct. Personally, I oppose locking people up unless they commit crimes, so I'd keep the government out of it until then. Once they commit a crime, you punish the substance abuser the same way you would punish a non substance abuser for that particular offense.

"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid."

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 19:10

Actually "Spirit Imprisonment" is a term that is used in many religions, especially Mormonism (http://eom.byu.edu/index.php/Spirit_Prison) and in Catholic Churches (http://www.balancedlifeministry.org/2011/02/are-you-in-a-spiritual-priso...). I did use literary license to term it as "Spiritual Imprisonment," but I will say that I meant it more as a form of mind and thought control.

Alcoholics Anonymous uses "spiritual principals" which are not defined to control its members in a sort of Spiritual Prison where everything is their fault and not the program, as well as everything you need to know can be found in the first 164 pages of the "Big Book." This is a form of mental imprisonment.

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

Pennywise's picture

Pennywise

Sun, 02/17/2013 - 19:15

Well, the government should not send people to AA because the Constitution forbids it. That should be the end of it, but of course some judges ignore the law.

"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid."

massive's picture

massive

Fri, 02/15/2013 - 19:10

There is some really bad stuff going on in AA meetings in Ohio. Just read my blog under FIle A Complaint.
The police need to go undercover over there. Its that bad.

Massive

NoAAUK's picture

NoAAUK

Sat, 02/16/2013 - 03:01

Theres some really bad stuff going on in ALL stepper cult meetings, vulnerable heads are continually being screwed up by the fearmongering garbage repeatedly spewed out by promoters of the cult and people are dying (except at the wonderfull spiritually uplifting meetings attended by steppers who post here).

This fact, that the stepper cults continually harm and drive people to suicide in the name of god (who can be a toilet seat) needs more and more exposure.......for that I am responsible

......and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Matthew 24:11

SimonTemplar

Fri, 02/15/2013 - 20:38

Hey Massive.It doesn't look like AA is going to get better.it sems the more that i read and research this keeps on a downhill roll.I had one AAer that i still talked with.but he always wanted to repeat and repeat
about the ALCOHOLIC GENE.When I told him,there is no such thing.I found on internet search that after becoming alcoholic some genetic activities can happen,but there is no such scientifc proof of any
"He was forced,by God,to become an alcoholic" ideation anywhere.He has backed off from friend ship.slowed down.He sees the doulbe talk-the lies/Sponsor cybertrolling when a sponsee left his sponsorship.But it's splitting him.Has been and is a dangerous place.I still carry extra edge for meetings.but it's been about 7 months w/o attending.If I return ,will be just to repeat what i've already said.I choose to worship GOD.Not group of diseased drunks.
Sso many here are attending meeting to find newbies to Thailand and sucker them into worthless investments.Steal their money.pLAY them for fools.Police now do attend meetings and that is PROGRESS.
So maybe in ohio,where the drug plague ahs hit hard,police will make changes forcibly.
Years here and it's okay to attack when someone disagrees with AA ideology and politics.They are self-destructing.A $3 million property that looks like users/losers live there-while the rest of the hospital is all brand new and shiny.but spend to remodel.OHH NOOO-the hospital has the PRIVILEGE of having AAmeetings on their grounds.
Better to light one Candle than to curse the darknes.My choice.I want to live in the light.

I SPY

NoAAUK's picture

NoAAUK

Sat, 02/16/2013 - 03:03

'Hey Massive.It doesn't look like AA is going to get better.it sems the more that i read and research this keeps on a downhill roll.I had one AAer that i still talked with.but he always wanted to repeat and repeat'

Steppism NEVER changes, its the first thing you notice if ever you go back, even after years, to the meetings/cult indoctrination sessions.

I've said it before and I'll say it again you can learn ALL there is to know about steppism in three months tops, the rest is just 'reptition.' Big Bill does not actually know any more about the cult than Little Bill. Big Bill has just regurgitated cult garbage MORE often.

Anyone for BS Bingo?

......and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Matthew 24:11