“Nobody’s going to stop us from being alcoholics.”

Trisha K.'s picture
Submitted by Trisha K. on Tue, 07/03/2012 - 15:08

As Eli Bald Eagle, who described himself as an alcoholic for more than 20 years, told me (Nicholas D. Kristof) unsteadily.

True declaration?

Comments

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 17:49

Experience has shown that no one can make you an admit your an Alcoholic except for the cult of Alcoholics Anonymous! Come to the Stepping Stones Ranch in Bedford Hills and you can learn how Danny B II did it! Watch the prospects getting dragged behind Danny's car to the front door steps!

Want to hire a more professional prospect hunter for those hard to get prospects? Hire Earl Hightower, Interventionist Extraordinaire and AA trapper! http://orange-papers.org/forum/node/611

Don't know what rehab to send them too to break them for you? Sent them to Burning Tree Ranch Rehab Texas who just announced the re-branding of it's Purpose based on the 12 Steps of Bill Wilson Prospect Hunting - http://orange-papers.org/forum/node/1753

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

Trisha K.'s picture

Trisha K.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 18:40

JR Harris stop acting as if you know anything about Earl Hightower, Clancy, Bill W. or Dr.Bob because you don't.
You are a fraud, you were never a member of Alcoholics Anonymous, you were never even an alcoholic (you didn't even a have subtle problem with alcohol and or drugs). Your claim to fame was riding the hem of your ex's skirt. She was the AA member, she put in the work and not only managed to get sober but changed her entire life. You think because you attended a few Al-Anon meeting and sat beside your wife in a couple of AA meetings this gives you the right to speak as if you are an authority on the subject of AA.
Jr, your posts that you have littered Stinkin Thinkin, RecoveringfromRecovery and the OPF, are an embarrassment to this whole community, anti's and supporters of AA. Because they are not with the intent to provide the truth. You purposely deceive, fabricate and down right lie with the comments you post. You believe by posting the link to your various articles that this exonerates you from being cast a liar, it doesn't.
You couldn't even carry Earl's nutsack if it fell off him while he was walking.

“The more I traveled the more I realized that fear makes strangers of people who should be friends.”
Shirley MacLaine

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 18:44

Meet Diablo, aka, Danny Bennison - http://stinkin-thinkin.com/2011/04/06/meet-diablo-aka-danny-bennison/

Be Careful - Just a quick heads up. One of our trolls, Danny Bennison, has been commenting here again under the name of “Quagmire.” His other aliases include the names: Cuggle, Diablo, Heretikreb and Danny B II. We’ve banned him, but like all cyber stalkers, he doesn’t respect other people’s boundaries. - http://stinkin-thinkin.com/2011/06/25/be-careful/

Dingbattery - A Life Gone Awry: My Story of the Elan School, is now available on Amazon. I have not read the whole book, but I have skimmed over the parts that reference one of our resident trolls, Danny Bennison (aka; Diablo/Cuggle/Quagmire/Claude). Currently, he’s cyber-stalking some of our readers, and is taking up residence with two other AA stooges and ST trolls, Mondotuna and A.A. Alfie, over at the JREF forum. - http://stinkin-thinkin.com/2011/09/07/dingbattery/

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

becket's picture

becket

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 18:48

So is Eli Bald Eagle a member of AA? If not, is it still possible, JR Harris, for him to be an alcoholic, or are all alcoholics in AA? Does one only become an alcoholic when one walks through the doors of a meeting? If a drunk can stop anytime he wants to, what would push him to the point of damage and death? How would you explain the deaths from cirrhosis and brain hemorrhage and drunken falls that end up with head trauma and all the other lovely tragedies that can and do happen to drunks? This is their "decision"?

Is a drunk an alcoholic? Is an alcoholic dependent on alcohol, or is that just in his mind? If it's just in his mind, how would you explain these disorders that occur as a result of ingesting alcohol to the point of physical deterioration:

Metabolic: ketoacidosis, hypoglycemia, water and salt disorders
Neurologic: chronic problems with thinking such as Wernicke's encephalopathy and Korsakoff's psychosis, cerebellar degeneration, and central pontine myelinolysis leading to problems walking and other motor activities, acute and chronic dementia, peripheral neuropathy
Muscular: acute and chronic muscle weakness
Gastrointestinal: fatty liver, hepatitis, cirrhosis, pancreatitis, poor pancreatic function, gastroesophageal reflux, esophageal carcinoma, erosive gastritis, chronic diarrhea, malabsorption, esophageal varices leading to bleeding into the GI tract
Metabolic-endocrine: high cholesterol, high levels of uric acid, low testosterone levels, impotence, testicular atrophy, gynecomastia, irregular menstrual periods, reversible Cushing's syndrome
Blood: anemia due to poor production of blood cells or slow intestinal bleeding, poor white cell production, destruction of platelets, blood too thin to clot properly.
Cardiac: decreased cardiac function, arrhythmias, dilated cardiomyopathy, high blood pressure
Pulmonary: increased incidence of pneumonia, increased incidence of tuberculosis
Other: increased incidence of severe intestinal infections, fetal alcohol syndrome, vitamin deficiency syndromes, trauma, sexual dysfunction, insomnia

Is it your theory that these things happen to drunks solely because the drunks choose not to stop drinking? Or do they happen only to alcoholics ... with insurance ... who feed the medical professions and make kings of treatment facilitators?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 18:53

Self fulfilling prophesy Self fulfilling prophesy, tell them it will happen and tell them they are Powerless over it and tempt them constantly with the proverbial "relapse" that they have no power over and you are looking for trouble. I'm not saying the diseases that you mentioned don't happen, but if you enter the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous that only has a 5% retention rate, the sample population will have a higher propensity of those diseases. NOTE: When I say diseases, I mean real ones, not the made up Spiritual Malady of Bill Wilson called "Alcoholism" to fund his his lifestyle.

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

steve cochrane's picture

steve cochrane

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 21:36

is . . . well . . .sad. Well I take that back it is . . .nothing. You can never cover all of the bases. Because we will make another one up tomorrow. Stop referring to people as drunks!! They are fellow human beings! If indeed you were once one, you would never use this term. Human beings create the conditions where people want to shift their moment to the extreme. The bar is set too high. Or . . . . ?

Trisha K.'s picture

Trisha K.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 22:37

steve, you seem to think I set this in motion, I did not. This is about a statement Bald Eagle made to a NY Times reporter.

“The more I traveled the more I realized that fear makes strangers of people who should be friends.”
Shirley MacLaine

steve cochrane's picture

steve cochrane

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 22:52

you did not set this in motion Trish. It is just that the references that we make towards each other in every aspect of life has huge effects. Most all end up being detrimental to our own personal growth. (IF we take them personaly) From my own experience it is very important that I disregard/or treat much of evrything that I was taught with a very healthy amount of skepticsm. Because most of that i was taught about you and myself and other human beings simply is not true. The Native American story holds a special place for me. Great lessons can be learned,because it is so close.

Trisha K.'s picture

Trisha K.

Wed, 07/04/2012 - 12:58

I posted these articles because I wanted to publicize the conflicting ideas, problems and solutions of a small town with a very large native american pop.
I have one overwhelming thought, Big Business is still raping the indigenous people of this country. This breaks my heart, also.

“The more I traveled the more I realized that fear makes strangers of people who should be friends.”
Shirley MacLaine

Ironic's picture

Ironic

Thu, 07/05/2012 - 21:24

I agree with most of what you're saying, but I call myself and certain acquaintances "junkies" every so often.

I guess it's kinda like saying "nigger" or "dyke," its NBD if you are one.

becket's picture

becket

Wed, 07/04/2012 - 02:58

If you're referring to me, steve, let me ask you this: have you ever noticed that there are very strict prohibitions on the usage of certain words on this forum? If you use any one of these words you are attacked mercilessly. These words include resentment, self-examination, happy/joyous/free, even alcoholic, even God. One can hardly get a word in without being smacked with shit for it.

"Drunks", however, is not on that list. At least I have never read anyone's objection to the word. And why should they? Those of us here who are or were alcohol dependent are drunks, pure and simple. Nothing derogatory about it, it's just a fact.

I don't know what your drug of choice is or was, but if it was booze, and you had developed a dependence on it for whatever reason, that makes you a drunk in my book. Not gonna tiptoe around your indignation over the use of the word. If Mr. Drunk suits you better, then that's what it will be.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

steve cochrane's picture

steve cochrane

Wed, 07/04/2012 - 04:53

I am not disputing 'what' we call each other. I am however objecting to categorizing anyone. It is almost automatic,and I believe that it is very harmful. Once categorized,it is difficult to shed. Even if it doesn't apply or never did apply. It is a judgement upon another. It is these type of judgements that I believe can distort anothers self image. We should not say to each other these things. Cursing at each other is different. Don't ask me why,I just feel that it is. Calling someone a shit is one thing. Calling someone a FAT shit is entirely another.

becket's picture

becket

Wed, 07/04/2012 - 15:43

"Calling someone a shit is one thing. Calling someone a FAT shit is entirely another." Your idea of a joke?

What would you have people call each other here? Since any derogatory terms seem to be out, shall we all be "human beings", "persons", "men" and "women"? I do the best I can to keep judgment out of posts, by calling people individuals. I nearly always mention both genders as s/he, or use the word "one" in place of he or she so people don't feel they're being discriminated against, as so many have outlined their absolute disgust over what they consider Bill Wilson's misogyny in "To Wives". I've been so correct it makes my head hurt -- UNTIL I am attacked. Then there is no high road, no political correctness, no Miss Manners. If people have it coming, it is because they have sent me an engraved invitation to give it to them. Of course they are all victims of my brusque manner and are highly offended by my choice of terms. Too fuckin bad. People should not expect a pass when they are overflowing with hate and they point it in my direction. I am candid, I'm frank, I tell the truth, and I'm sick of all these tender pansies pouting about someone outside their realm telling them what they look like from out here. Go invest in BandAids, people.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

steve cochrane's picture

steve cochrane

Wed, 07/04/2012 - 01:32

Reverse the conditions or afflictions or diseases or temporary misunderstandins,just kidding syndrome? I know little of myself so I must fuck with you syndrome! I will always think that I will truly know,something that I can pass along that will benefit mankind. A song maybe?

becket's picture

becket

Wed, 07/04/2012 - 03:00

Who is this addressed to, steve, and what the hell does it mean?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 17:55

The Hunter-Gatherers of Alcoholics Anonymous (AA) - Transition from Hunting and gathering to Livestock Management and expanded searches - http://orange-papers.org/forum/node/724

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

Trisha K.'s picture

Trisha K.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 19:06

JR, Bald eagle is still drinking. HE, BALD EAGLE, considers himself an alcoholic. JR, you do know that Bill and Bob did not invent the word/diagnosis; Alcoholic, right?

"There’s something to that. As Eli Bald Eagle, who described himself as an alcoholic for more than 20 years, told me unsteadily, “Nobody’s going to stop us from being alcoholics.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/06/opinion/sunday/kristof-a-battle-with-t...

“The more I traveled the more I realized that fear makes strangers of people who should be friends.”
Shirley MacLaine

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 19:20

So you know all of the high profile AA prospect hunters? Earl Hightower, Interventionist Extraordinaire and AA trapper - http://orange-papers.org/forum/node/611

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

disclosure

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 20:29

I know alot of the people on this blog are anti AA but you seem pro AA. As a pro AA do you think meetings would help me?

Trisha K.'s picture

Trisha K.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 20:36

....

“The more I traveled the more I realized that fear makes strangers of people who should be friends.”
Shirley MacLaine

disclosure

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 20:28

You are a really cool AA, what meetings do you go to?

Trisha K.'s picture

Trisha K.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 20:37

...

“The more I traveled the more I realized that fear makes strangers of people who should be friends.”
Shirley MacLaine

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 20:57

Mass deleting of posts again Danny?

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

Trisha K.'s picture

Trisha K.

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 20:36

....

“The more I traveled the more I realized that fear makes strangers of people who should be friends.”
Shirley MacLaine

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 20:57

Mass deleting of posts again Danny? Another melt down?

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

becket's picture

becket

Tue, 07/03/2012 - 21:37

Trisha's posts don't necessarily reflect deletions. Maybe she was indicating that she didn't have time to respond to Disclosure's and your bullshit, JR Harris. Don't you have a flag to hang somewhere or some children to scare?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Ink

Wed, 07/04/2012 - 03:34

The social and interpersonal issues here are very much apart from the way any given person
metabolizes alcohol. Problem drinking to deal with social and personal problems is supposedly not the same as having a metabolic deficiency in processing alcohol which leads to the drinking problem of alcoholism.

becket's picture

becket

Wed, 07/04/2012 - 15:34

Are you a believer in the "metabolic deficiency" Ink? If so, could you elaborate on that; if not, could you make your case for there being no such thing?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian