Depression and God

Submitted by humanspirit on Thu, 04/26/2012 - 11:59

Not quite as off-topic as it seems. There's an interesting debate going on over at the Guardian at the moment - apparently some evangelical christian has said that depression is caused by ego, resentments, self-pity, etc. and that finding God is the answer (now where have we all heard something like that before?):

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/belief/2012/apr/26/god-cure-depr...

Substitute 'addiction' for 'depression' and you'll get what I mean by this not being off-topic.

Comments

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 19:22

Yet you continue to minimize the experience of others. Sympathy is far from what anyone needs. I firmly believe that, but to on one hand say you have heard of this happening yet continually slam your puff in our faces is a diss.

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

Clara's picture

Clara

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 19:46

Avo, that someone has a different experience in no way minimizes those of others. It has nothing to do with it. If I hadn\'t come to OPF, I wouldn\'t have known about any of these alleged abuses or practices in rehabs. But I still question a few things. I don\'t understand how Soberman can spend decades in a fellowship that he never embraced to any degree. So why invest the time? If you can read the steps on the wall, why can you not see that God is in those steps? Can you leave rehab (which serves for many as a way to distance themselves from the actual substance) and go find SOS or SMART instead of AA? Does the rehab keep tabs on you to see if you are doing after care? Much of what is said here can just be confusing, but I wonder if that in part isn\'t because how you see thing now verses THEN are very far apart. I know people that left rehab and didn\'t do anything further.

If I were here telling you wonderful my life was and changed for the better because of SOS, would that somehow make it better? Could I have said SMART was great and 60% have a God surveyed by Tom even have some sort of god intheir lives? Would this make any of your responses different to me? Or are they really motivated more by personality than how someone got sober?

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 20:23

Quite different scenarios you offer. I didn\'t participate in SOS and SMART and therefore wasn\'t negatively affected by them. I\'m not prejudice of your experience. The first couple of times you posted about them I congratulated you and expressed happiness to you. That was months ago. Now I am annoyed. An experience with a program that was to say the least, dreadful for me is every day minimized by you through the constant review of your success. Among other things I look for some healing here, there are not many places that I can go for this, yet you don\'t care that you inhibit some growth by me or others. You only care that you don\'t understand and have the right to be here. That\'s insensitive and quite opposite to what you say you learned to become by your experience.

I\'ve answered your questions before, I\'m not going to repeat them because you don\'t understand.

I think Soberman has his own blog, track him down and ask him. Good luck Clara, and take care!

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

Clara's picture

Clara

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 20:33

I have asked him Avo, to no avail. I can only conclude that there was something, anything, he was getting out of it to make it worth his while. I am ONE person that found happiness in AA. People on this board are quick to point out that I must be some sort of rarity because AA has a high failure rate to them.

But I don\'t get why some people would continue to go back since it was so miserable for them. The same people that think I should have respect and leave this board are the same ones that don\'t think trolling a meeting, as Monica puts it, is a similar behavior. While I defend your right to say what you want, I didn\'t think it was fair or appropriate to go into a halfway house through an AA group to lead a meeting so you could give your message. I mean, your message in part is that meetings are unnecessary.

But my question is why do you think that people should behave in a fashion that isn\'t required of yourself?

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 21:07

Haha!

You are soooo wrong. For the upteenth time +1, I am again correcting you. I didn\'t talk at a half way house, it was a hospital. Remember that. A detox facility/ Psych ward that is in a HOSPITAL. And I didn\'t share that meetings were unnecessary, I shared that it wasn\'t necessary to admit powerlessness and also that it wasn\'t necessary to do the steps. Well, my experience was that it wasn’t necessary.

I suggest that you copy and paste this in a document on the computer. You can refer to it from time to time, it will help you get your facts straight.

Btw, I was NEVER told that I was bothering anyone and I was conversely THANKED for my share at the hospital. I shared hope for people that have addiction to substances. They loved it and they were happy for me.

To answer your question, I don’t think that people should behave in a fashion that is not required of myself. I didn’t do anything that wasn’t appreciated and I didn’t get any indication that I was anything but either.

A better comparison, similar behavior to what you are doing here Clara, would be if I went and told them how I still did drugs and will continually do so because they are wonderful and it doesn’t have any negative affect on me. Imagine that! Here people are struggling with substances that are killing them and just because I don’t understand what they are going through, I tell them that I never had a problem with it, using drugs excessively actually helped me. And when they complained about my share I told them I’d keep coming back to tell them how much I loved drugs because I had a right to.

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

Clara's picture

Clara

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 07:02

Hopsital, detox, I apologize for getting it wrong. But the point was and is that you went in through an AA outlet when you could have just come back another day. You felt that your message was important enough to go tell, which is fine. I just find it curious that you could be the dissenting opinion in a care facility that has a specific plan of recovery, but you forget that all opinions are welcome here on OPF. Monica calls that trolling a meeting, and I agree with her. I am glad that YOURS had a positive outcome, but you won\'t really know that. I remember telling you to share the joy of recovery rather than blast any program. THAT I agree with. In that way, your approach differs significantly from that of Monica. What you did apparently differed much from what you indicated you would do. I would never DOWN any program in a scene like that because you don\'t know who in that group is actually benefiting from it. Perhaps in your original posts on it, where you questioned the wisdom of going, you were a bit hyped up. I am glad it worked out. Have they called you for a repeat visit?

What is in AA that isn\'t here on OPF? You have your resident stalker that if he could do anything he claims, he would know that Beckett and I are not the same person and that I was in Daytona. You have people that take your imformation and twist it completely just so they can complain and bitch, you have the snidely folks that say the same types of things that you and Patti both have posted about... You have the posters that make you feel that if your post isn\'t perfectly posted and with sources only they can choose, it isn\'t valid. You even have the \"why are you here\" bunch that generally asked folks that didn\'t want to be there, didn\'t do any of the work, participate in any way... yet sat in the rooms and drank coffee and ate cookies. Yet you all claim to be sober people, recovered people. For me, what you all describe is just what you bring to this forum.

I think your comparison to drug usage is wrong. My presence here is nothing like that. Why aren\'t you applying your example to Ironic, who DOES come to the board and post about drug use? Just another double standard. At least Ironic is anti-AA. And, Ironic, since I have misidentified you before, if you are completely clean, then I apologize for using those posts as an example.

Here on the OPF, where all opinions are welcome.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 08:51

I never said I would down AA. Wrong again Clara! As usual you see and here what you want to and repeat it. I didn\'t say I would down a particular program either, unless I was asked. I wasn\'t asked btw. I shared what worked for me, which was not step work and powerlessness but a different approach. Massive\'s agenda was different, being about the crime and dangers within and around the rooms. I\'m proud of her, and I don\'t care what she or anyone calls it. The message was about safety and truth, and as I said before, this is never wrong.

Ironic doesn\'t share anything that is bothersome to me because the OPF isn\'t about recovery, it is not a recovery forum. I COMPARED someone going to a RECOVERY CENTER and sharing that. What you do here is comparable because we discuss how AA has harmed us and others, and you comment about how wonderful it is. It is not a double standard, it is an analogy. You cannot understand this or don\'t want to.

Btw, IF Ironic did tempt me or anyone else when she occasionally mentions getting high, I think if I expressed this to her she would be considerate and not do it anymore. There is another difference between you and her, not just AA or anti. Respect and empathy. It does happen to be a learned attribute of members in AA. \"This is a selfish program\". You seemed to adapt to the \'principle\' of selfishness quite well.

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

Clara's picture

Clara

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:18

Sorry that i lost my original response to list, but internet was wacky.

So, Ironic\'s discussions don\'t tempt or bother you, but mine do? That seems at odd. As for Monica\'s safety concerns, I think she is spot on with that. If it is illegal outside the rooms, it surely is inside and shouldn\'t be sanctioned for a minute. But her posts suggest that hre sahres at meetings aren\'t limited to that. Then she comes back and goes on about how much she hates AA. Then don\'t expose yourslef to it! She can still be an activist, and she should be. We have safety issues on OPF, Avo. My husband filtered out some lunatics so that they no longer have access to me. Do you think everything seems cozy on this forum? Or does it sound just a bit creepy? I think it is ironic that someone would say anything about the Danny character when there is a cast here that can be just as silly.

I don\'t see how you feel that going into any arena with a meesage different than what they are selling is necessary welcome. You suggest I am doing that yet yours is somehow different. Have they called to invite you back or did they say courteous things while walking you out the door? I agree the model isn\'t for everyone but there might be some in that recovery house, detox, hospital (wahtever) that might have been benefiting. I have been glad to learn about SOS and SMART because of a friend of mine that is experiencing growth pains in AA. Perhaps it isn\'t for her and it was nice to not only say that to her, but to be able to point her in a direction. But she had the same issue I do. No availability.

I hear a lot on this board that I accept as your experiences, but mine WAS different and I think there is as much merit in my effort here as there is in yours at the facility.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

Ironic's picture

Ironic

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 07:21

Well there is some common ground, because none of us understand why the fuck you are here besides getting your jollies making others miserable

Clara's picture

Clara

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 08:56

OPF is an open forum, Ironic. I wish we could stick to topics instead of personalities, but it always goes back to the same thing, trying to bully a person because of a belief. But the issue before the person, and perhaps some real dialogue could take place. What is the difference about trolling AA meetings because you wants your side to be heard and coming to a board because you want to learn? I can think of a few things. You\'ll notice too that no one will just jump over someone\'s post. They can, you know.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:09

Minimize, deny, and diss is what you do.

I\'d be happy to discuss what you have learned from the OP, but you don\'t do that. Perhaps start a new blog or topic here. A good one would be the affect Buchmanism had on AA. For years this was left out of AA\'s history. To the point that many don\'t know who he is and that Bill W. along with Dr. Bob and a few others were members of this Evangelical Cult. I think they should update the BB, what do you think?

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

Clara's picture

Clara

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:20

Actually, I don\'t. It\'s worked for 75 years. You want the BB updated to reflect an agenda it doesn\'t have...but that you do.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:24

You have no proof, zip, zilch except for Dry Angry Drunks like yourself who are continually parroting that lie.

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:34

The BB is fiction and bad literature to boot. If they printed the truth, I wouldn\'t have a problem with it. There isn\'t a single claim within that is backed up by a scientific study and the methods have been proven to hurt more than help them.

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

becket's picture

becket

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 12:25

\"National Velvet\" was fiction, but it inspired lots and lots of young girls to learn how to ride horses.

Do you contend that the whole of the Big Book is fiction? Or maybe that the stories are non-fiction but the steps themselves are fiction? Does it matter how the book is categorized? Just like the influence of any other book, it is powerful to those who find it resonates with them, and it\'s bunk to those who find it does not resonate with them. Some will find the resonance dissipates with time, and maybe that can be attributed to personal growth.

There is much credence given to scientific study here, and none to the placebo effect (which has been scientifically studied, thank you). Human beings are not all enamored of science. Alcoholics just want relief. Some will find it in AA and others will find it elsewhere. And some will not find it. I would imagine those numbers, if carefully scrutinized, would be found to unchanged across the spectrum of time since AA\'s inception. Some will quit for good and be happy. Some will quit for good and be miserable. Some will bounce back and forth. Some will not quit. There\'s a certain cosmic hilarity to all the scrambling we are doing searching for answers to the questions of alcoholism. Maybe that\'s why Clara is here, for the entertainment factor. That is part of the reason I\'m here. The other part is that I enjoy searching for the aneurisms within the posters\' arguments here. It\'s a hobby. It\'s my sudoku. It keeps my mind alive. And when I have a chance to argue for the defense I take it. It\'s like GE College Bowl, only it features a few players who are not up to the task. Entertainment.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:11

Face it Clara, quit being a Dry Drunk and run on now. Your lame tactics are well known. If we really wanted to know what your next post is going to be about all we have to do is read - Propaganda and Debating Techniques by A. Orange - http://orange-papers.org/orange-propaganda.html

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

btnben's picture

btnben

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:13

You\'re unbelievable!!! You keep on about \"principles before personalities\". Where does that expression come from? Would it be the 12th Tradition of AA? Is this an anti-AA site? Can you understand why people think you\'re stupid?

FFS - it\'s like talking to a child.

Is someone writes something that is insane and others point out the insanity, that\'s not bullying. If the same person keeps on repeating the same insanity and the reactions get more heated, that\'s not bullying, that\'s frustration at having to listen to a fucking idiot. Are you getting it Clara?

AA says you\'re not allowed to be judgmental Clara. It\'s not very clever to come onto an ant-AA site and acuse everyone of drinking or using. That is not the way to create a meaningful dialogue (bet Marietta responds to that one...lol). You are not here to learn. You won\'t discuss anything, as in answer questions. All you do is parrot, and I do mean parrot, the AA line. Most people on here have dismissed that crap as worthless. Can you not see why people find it annoying? Are you that stupid? Go to e-AA - you\'ll be right at home there. Bored shitless, but right at home...lol

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Clara's picture

Clara

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:22

It sounds like it to me, Ben. If this is their sobriety, fine. It certainly doesn\'t sound very peaceful. I am not having a judgment based on contempt prior to investigation. I\'ve spent enough time here to form my own opinions, which I can have.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

btnben's picture

btnben

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:26

That reply is completely meaningless as usual. You don\'t like the people here - fuck off. You have nothing to offer anyone here so - fuck off. AA says you shouldn\'t be judgmental at all so - fuck off. That quote was misused by Bill W - it means the opposite. Do us all a favour Clara, and fuck off.

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Clara's picture

Clara

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 11:24

Ben, we are simply going to have to agree to disagree! The biggest lie you all put forth about AA is that people that can have no opinions, cannot speak out, cannot do this or do that... when those things are either limited or not true at all.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

Clara's picture

Clara

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:25

It simply means to keep personalities out of the issues, which no one on the board can do. I\'ve posted that explanation before and you are free to disagree with me, Ben. It is also something that most negotiators learn very quickly, so it surely isn\'t a thought limited or originating in AA.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:29

especially on the Orange papers Forum. Clara, if you want to practice your slogans on someone, why don\'t you volunteer to go the the local jails and prisons with your Intergroup to recruit criminals to bring back to church basements to perform weird pagan rituals?

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

becket's picture

becket

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 12:02

\"I think it means angry dry drunks should not parrot AA slogans.\" Nor should cuckolded, wannabe-drunks parrot AA slogans for a cheap laugh, as if they have any idea what they\'re saying.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Ironic's picture

Ironic

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 12:37

What the hell does people trolling AA meetings have to do with your presence here????

95% of this forum does not attend AA or NA or CA or xA of any sort for any reason.

Why can you never answer a question directly?

gigi

Thu, 04/26/2012 - 19:37

Regarding most people as being sick and in need because their opinions and experiences differ from yours does not make you a more balanced and tolerant person. It makes you condescending and arrogant.

"If I forget who I am, I am myself. If I remember who I am, I am you."

Clara's picture

Clara

Thu, 04/26/2012 - 19:58

Not opinion or experiences, Gigi.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

becket's picture

becket

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 20:28

I do hope btnben gets a chance to read ^^this^^ and ruminate.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

humanspirit

Thu, 04/26/2012 - 19:27

Clara says: "Through AA I became a much more balanced and tolerant person."

Well, I hate to think what you were like before you went to AA, Clara. ( Not that you don't come across as a completely well-balanced and tolerant person, obviously.) I'm glad you took my advice, rejoined AA, and started going back to meetings - apart from the meetings you attend on vacation, that is. I hope you will find some serenity and peace of mind in them.

Could you tell us a bit more about the principles of AA?

Btw, everyone else, how do you manage to do block quotes?

Clara's picture

Clara

Thu, 04/26/2012 - 19:58

I never took your advice, HS. I had always gone to meetings here, just not with the regularity I had in MB. I find there is much more serenity in AA than there ever would be among these on this board. Then again, I think most of you are still shooting and imbibing. The behavior certainly is not normal.

G'night, HS.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

humanspirit

Thu, 04/26/2012 - 20:12

Sleep well.

I think you'll find that most people posting here are neither shooting nor imbibing, but if it comforts you to think so, so be it.

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Thu, 04/26/2012 - 22:16

Perhaps because this is not a recommended board for recovery. It's mainly debate or discussion. Serenity is not advertised. Your bound to come across some hostility, and I doubt that most anyone's appearance is well represented. I don't interact this way regularly, I try not to let any of this effect my personal life.
Try and compare it to a debate about politics. That's not like a friendly game of chess either.

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

Brett

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 00:10

you think sucken that 12 step dick is normal behaviour? you think trolling here all day is normal? you think claiming a 6 beer binge makes you an alcoholic - is normal, by anyones standard.
6 bloody beer binge, I'm still lmao.

Brett

btnben's picture

btnben

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 05:30

"Then again, I think most of you are still shooting and imbibing. "

As you no longer mix with such people, in fact your sponsor told you to relocate to get away from them, may I respectfully suggest that you fuck off for your own protection? I'm only thinking of you Clara. Don't want you to run the risk of thinking for yourself - AA wouldn't like it.

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Clara's picture

Clara

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 07:29

My sponsor knew very well that I would want to do everything that I had done before because I couldn't see life any other way. Annapolis is a drinking town with a boating problem. Everyone I knew was involved in a club of some sort. Boating is like that, too. More beer on the boat than fuel! It was easier to just expedite my retirement and go to my home in MB and try that for six months. Come back then if I wanted to. And he was right, Ben. It my haze, I didn't think there could be more people in the world than this group of people I thought were legitimate friends. You know what they say. Stop drinking and then see who calls. Even if I didn't understand it then, I sure do now. When I look at my facebook, I see those same people, doing the same things, and I would have been down there with them.

As for naffing off, I will when you do. And I mean that with all respect.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

btnben's picture

btnben

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 08:01

You come on this site with nothing to offer except abuse, like you're all using and drinking, and then moan about people not being nice to you.

Would you also refrain from using the phrase principles before personalities until you are prepared to say what the principles are. It just makes you look stupid - like a push button alkie parroting slogans.

And FFS use a spell checker - half of your posts simply don't make sense. It's worse than dealing witha child.

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Clara's picture

Clara

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 14:45

Ben, I don\'t think I have abused anyone. Look at your own behavior towards me from the first moment because you thought I was someone else. I certainly felt from the tone of yesterday that these were just not sober people. There is making a point or posting an opinion. It all is a great example as to why praticing princibles before personalities is a good general lesson, AA or not. If you don\'t know what they are, then you just didn\'t spend any time in AA. There is also stuff that just isn\'t necessary. For example, of JR\'s stalking crap. I can\'t get his posts anymore since my husband did something to the computer to field him out because JR is just a weird personality. This has been far beyond just being nice to someone. I also do not care about spellcheck. If it bothers you so much, then feel free to just jump over my posts. No one makes you read them or respond to them but you. Besides, I notice that you don\'t criticize the spelling from other posters. We all make mistakes, including you, so why the double standard?

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

btnben's picture

btnben

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 14:50

there are no princibles (sic). I spent a lot longer than you have in AA and I actually questioned it rather than just swallowing it hook, line and sinker.

As far as spelling is concerned, that\'s not really the point. The problem is that you regularly post things that simply don\'t make any sense.

AND YOU STILL HAVEN\'T ANSWERED THE QUESTION. Everyone knows you CAN post on here, but why would you want to, all day every day, if you disagree with what the forum stands for? What do you hope to achieve?

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

becket's picture

becket

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 11:57

\"Is that your way of finally admitting there are no princibles (sic). I spent a lot longer than you have in AA and I actually questioned it rather than just swallowing it hook, line and sinker.

As far as spelling is concerned, that\'s not really the point. The problem is that you regularly post things that simply don\'t make any sense.\"

You spent more than five years in AA but you questioned it all along and were not a hook/line/sinker attendee? Bullshit. It does not take five years of seething the way you do to inspire a person to leave AA. What was it that kept you there? Were you simply hoping beyond hope your life would get better? Were you digging ever deeper in a non-hook/line/sinker way to attempt to understand the depths of the program? Were you hooking up with the vulnerable 30-year-old divorcee/drunk in your home group? Why did you stay so long if you were so unfathomably hip to AA\'s fallibility?

Spelling is not the point? Why, then, are you compelled to draw attention to it?

Was für ein clown.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

btnben's picture

btnben

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 12:06

Even with Google translate, shit-for-brains gets it wrong...lol

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

Unhinged

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 12:12

Sind nicht die übersetzer erhalten Sie im internet noch etwas? Super!

becket's picture

becket

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 12:32

[Readers: please note who threw the first profanity punch. ^^^]

Oh my God, btnben, I\'ve offended you. I am so sorry for having used Google Translate, but you see, I don\'t speak that repulsive, guttural language. Please, just give me six months to go enroll in the local community college so I can take a quick course on German. That way I will be able to tell you daily, in German, in no uncertain terms, and perhaps in a dialect you would celebrate, what a thoroughly sorry fucker you truly are.

I\'m on my way to the college now, btnben. Please, just give me some time . . .

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

btnben's picture

btnben

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 12:38

[Readers: please note who threw the first profanity punch. ^^^]

Don\\\'t you just love the victim card...lol.

Repulsive, guttural language? This from someone who was quoting Goethe earlier? Obviously not in the original...lol. And if you find it so repulsive, why did you start posting in it incorrectly? What a clown...lol

Once a fucking idiot, always a fucking idiot Marietta...lol

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

becket's picture

becket

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 12:45

The Goethe passage that was quoted on the forum was quoted in English, as I recall.

You are hell-bent on misidentifying your nemeses. It could be your undoing.

I don\'t consider myself a victim because I have not been injured or wounded in any way. It\'s important, though, that your littermates can see what a mongrel you really are. I don\'t have to do a single thing - it\'s perfectly clear just the way it played out. Perfectly clear - unlike that hideous sounding, revolting second language you speak.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 12:11

Marrietta, you claim to not have been to an AA meeting for the last 22 years. How can you possibly have more time in AA than Ben? Unless of course are LYING and making up stories like Clara.

The more lies you make, the more you have to make up to cover the first ones up.

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

becket's picture

becket

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 12:38

What are you referring to, JR Harris? I have not been to a meeting for 22 years, that is correct. I have no idea how much time btnben had in AA, but I can see he a) didn\'t get anything out of it, b) still manages to carry a grudge about it, and c) it is all extraneous information. What more is there to know? Where\'s the lie?

I didn\'t say I was in AA longer than he was. He said he was in AA longer than Clara (5 years). Is that what has you so confused?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

btnben's picture

btnben

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 14:52

How can anyone practice princibles (sic) if they don\'t know what they are. You obviously do. Why not share these princibles (sic)?

God damn it, get me a whiskey

Bill W, Deathbed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=Sdn3O6aaMNc

causeandeffect's picture

causeandeffect

Fri, 04/27/2012 - 15:14

You\'ll never get an answer to that. Doesn\'t even understand the same phrase she uses over and over and over about principles before personalities. She\'s just here to gaslight, nothing more, nothing less. It is a very insidious form of abuse. Every time she says that AA doesn\'t say that it\'s the only way and that every member will tell you that--that is gaslighting. Pure and simple.

Troll free AA critical forum
http://www.expaa.org/

"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it." ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson

Ironic's picture

Ironic

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 08:21

Clara, can you share with me the undoubtedly accurate rubric on which you grade the sobriety of other posters here on OPF?

I\'m sure everyone would be mighty interested

Clara's picture

Clara

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 08:58

It may not be rubric, but how people treat people is a reasonable estimation. These people behave like people in bar brawls. I\'ve already gone down the cast of characters in another post.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Sat, 04/28/2012 - 09:03

What does your NA hubby think about all of this?

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

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