Newcomers Rescue League

Great idea. Not too likely though. A lot of people seem to get off on the power of being a sponsor and trying to run someone's life.

First, you get "pushed in". After that you're told you're in denial. Is this the true order of coercion? Because there is a huge window between the two through which anyone can flee, and that is the "just say no" window. How is it that two strong, intelligent women allowed others to make this choice for them? How does anyone allow others to call the shots here? This is the first instance of turning one's will and life over to a "higher power". How can anyone criticize AA for making such a demand of them when they have already succumbed to this suggestion before they stepped through the doors of a meeting or a treatment center?

I acknowledge the presence of mental and emotional vulnerability here. I'm just curious about the surrender aspect of trying AA. I went to AA on my own after a bludgeoning with alcohol; maybe those of us who choose AA rather than having been funneled into it have less resistance to the program and so we benefit from it more. Just a theory.

Sorry, Persephone, but was this in response to Clara or to me? It's hard to follow, as you know!

PIE, it sounds awful. One thing that I have gathered from people that go to rehab is that there are some people that need that kind of regimentation. Others don't. I know very high functioning alcoholics and drug addicts that didn't need to be told when to brush their teeth, although Dena was just a wreck that she describes as needing someone to tell her to get out of bed, brush her teeth, put on makeup, the BLUE top, not the red because she wore it yesterday, and come to the meeting. Don't forget to block out some time for lunch afterward. I don't think that everyone needs that, and I feel that most programs seem to be geared for worst case scenarios. I feel that way, too, about the "drink and die" stuff. I never felt that way about myself but I can see how others can and did. If you have your BB and can read the last story, that is how I viewed AA. How to live sober. I didn't know people that didn't drink and I knew if I wanted to not drink, I had to make dramatic changes. AA helped me to create another life.

I don't have an answer for you other than the AA information is out there for sale, and there isn't a limit on who buys it. At one time in AA's history, the only way to do the program was to buy a book through mail order and do it yourself. The meeting concept developed from people in Bill's house that congregated and that people started knocking on the door to participate. I never did understand how someone could take the material and tinker with it to make it something different (a la SOS), although there only has to be a 10% difference in many things for it to slide... I don't know how so many things were able to be copied from AA, even when the copyrights were in effect, other than perhaps it was felt that it was better to help others than to claim intellectual property rights. And that was true until the German case where someone was changing the works.

I know many people that come to AA via family pressure. I don't doubt that some of these people genuinely want to get well while others still consider themselves to be just having fun without realizing that it is to try recovery or they will leave. There is a problem somewhere in that mix or the family wouldn't be doing what they are doing when they do those interventions. I know others that think the family won't leave while it is halfway out the door and it is apparent to everyone. They might not consider themselves to be an alcoholic or an addict, but SOMETHING brought this family to where it was...

Do you mind me asking why there are members of the family that you don't talk to? I had an uncle that was angry for a long time when his family put him in the "haushka" even though he knew he was jeapordizing everything around him. He didn't see that while the choice may have been faulty, there weren't many other options to removing him from where he was, taking over the control of the business and running things until he could make rational decisions. To this day, though, Carl cannot understand that his alcoholism created brain damage and that he will never be who he was at one time. That's hard.